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Ten Meter Meteor Scatter Video #10M Meteor Scatter Video JT9-Fast Modes #10m


Tony
 

All:

The idea of using meteor scatter to communicate on a dead 10 meter band caught my attention many years ago. I've done extensive testing since then and found that meteor scatter is relatively easy to accomplish on this band.

I've worked 6 meter meteor scatter for many years and the impression one gets is that QSO success rates are likely to be higher on 10 compared to 6 meters and especially 2 meters.

That observation coincides with general radio meteor theory that says longer wavelengths provide longer more intense meteor trail reflections -- something I've seen repeatedly during testing which is shown in the attached spectrogram.

To illustrate what a 10 meter meteor scatter QSO is like, I recorded a short video of one of the QSO's I had with VE2FXL. We used one of the WSJT JT9 fast-modes designed to decode short-lived meteor scatter reflections.

See: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-C8XMhgkF4

So 10 meters may be a good alternative for those who do not have 6 meter capability and would like to try meteor scatter. It's also a way to make use of 10 meters during the lull in the sunspot cycle or at night when the band becomes dormant.

Tony -K2MO


Ev Tupis <w2ev@...>
 

In the early days of PropNET (http://www.PropNET.org) we used AX.25 on 10 and 6 meters.  We found 10 meters to be very productive for meteor work as a result.  We have since moved to PSK31 where we have documented MS propagation on that mode, too.

Interestingly, the "sweet spot" for commercial meteor scatter operations is in the 40 MHz range right between those two bands.

Ev, W2EV

PS: The PropNET Project will be end on or about December 31 after 20 years of operation.



On Thursday, December 20, 2018, 5:07:04 PM EST, Tony <DXDX@...> wrote:


All:

The idea of using meteor scatter to communicate on a dead 10 meter band
caught my attention many years ago. I've done extensive testing since
then and found that meteor scatter is relatively easy to accomplish on
this band.

I've worked 6 meter meteor scatter for many years and the impression one
gets is that QSO success rates are likely to be higher on 10 compared to
6 meters and especially 2 meters.

That observation coincides with general radio meteor theory that says
longer wavelengths provide longer more intense meteor trail reflections
-- something I've seen repeatedly during testing which is shown in the
attached spectrogram.

To illustrate what a 10 meter meteor scatter QSO is like, I recorded a
short video of one of the QSO's I had with VE2FXL. We used one of the
WSJT JT9 fast-modes designed to decode short-lived meteor scatter
reflections.


So 10 meters may be a good alternative for those who do not have 6 meter
capability and would like to try meteor scatter. It's also a way to make
use of 10 meters during the lull in the sunspot cycle or at night when
the band becomes dormant.

Tony -K2MO





asobel@...
 

Tony
1. You are showing JT9-G mode. I am using WSJT-X v2.0.0 but can't find it. How?
2. How do I get meteor scatter QSO? Do I have to arrange a meeting with somebody?

Amos 4X4MF


Tony
 

Amos:

> You are showing JT9-G mode. I am using WSJT-X v2.0.0 but can't find it. How?

Go to Files / Settings / General and select Enable VHF/UHF Microwave Features. Check the FAST box on the main window to enable the JT-9 fast modes then check sub-mode G. Change the TX/RX stetting from 60 seconds to 15 seconds.

> How do I get meteor scatter QSO? Do I have to arrange a meeting with somebody?

Most meteor scatter QSO's are made online using live sked pages like Ping Jockey https://www.pingjockey.net/cgi-bin/pingtalk while some are made at random. This video shows that you can make random contacts without skeds by monitoring the calling frequencies: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DZZj1HUJIY

I'm not sure which sked page is used in your region Amos -- I'll poke around and see what I can find. Keep in mind that the majority of meteor scatter activity is located in the U.S. and Europe on 6 and 2 meters using MSK144. Maximum range is 1,300 miles.

You can check which stations are in range of your QTH with PSK Reporter. Do a search for 6 meters and the MSK144 mode. https://www.pskreporter.info/pskmap.html

Tony -K2MO

 





On 12/21/2018 10:44 AM, asobel@... wrote:
Tony
1. You are showing JT9-G mode. I am using WSJT-X v2.0.0 but can't find it. How?
2. How do I get meteor scatter QSO? Do I have to arrange a meeting with somebody?

Amos 4X4MF



Tony
 

Amos:

See reply below. Hope this helps.

Tony -K2MO

____________________________________________________

Hi Tony,

The main site used for VHF / UHF sheds in EU is ON4KST http://www.on4kst.com/index.php

This site also has Region 2 and Region 3 pages for stations in those Regions to make QSOs with stations local to them, but many US, Caribbean and near east stations log into the 50MHz Region 1 chat in the SpE season.

The web interface for ON4KST takes a bit of getting used to, but is superb in what it can show. However, if chatting is your main use, then KST2Me by OZ2M is a much better way to use the ON4KST chat: http://www.rudius.net/oz2m/software/kst2me/ < KST2Me is free, but you need to request a key from OZ2M. Also KST2Me uses Telnet to connect to the ON4KST server, this is bandwidth light and even works well on slow 2G/GPRS connections, KST2Me is my main way of using the ON4KST chat. I then use the likes of DXMaps to show the current band activity, and PSKReporter for viewing, on a map, won I'll RX'ing, and where I'm being heard.

BR,

Gavin Nesbitt, M1BXF.
http://www.geekshed.co.uk


Tony
 

Ev:

With PSK31 printing less than 3 characters per second, I would assume the productive periods you're referring to coincide with major showers where meteor trail reflections are long enough in duration to capture call signs?

I take it that there's little data being captured during non-shower periods (daily sporadic activity) where vast majority of the reflections are short-lived?

Is there a way to search the PropNet archives to see the data you're referring to?

Tony -K2MO



On 12/21/2018 3:36 AM, Ev Tupis via Groups.Io wrote:
In the early days of PropNET (http://www.PropNET.org) we used AX.25 on 10 and 6 meters.  We found 10 meters to be very productive for meteor work as a result.  We have since moved to PSK31 where we have documented MS propagation on that mode, too.

Interestingly, the "sweet spot" for commercial meteor scatter operations is in the 40 MHz range right between those two bands.

Ev, W2EV

PS: The PropNET Project will be end on or about December 31 after 20 years of operation.



On Thursday, December 20, 2018, 5:07:04 PM EST, Tony <DXDX@...> wrote:


All:

The idea of using meteor scatter to communicate on a dead 10 meter band
caught my attention many years ago. I've done extensive testing since
then and found that meteor scatter is relatively easy to accomplish on
this band.

I've worked 6 meter meteor scatter for many years and the impression one
gets is that QSO success rates are likely to be higher on 10 compared to
6 meters and especially 2 meters.

That observation coincides with general radio meteor theory that says
longer wavelengths provide longer more intense meteor trail reflections
-- something I've seen repeatedly during testing which is shown in the
attached spectrogram.

To illustrate what a 10 meter meteor scatter QSO is like, I recorded a
short video of one of the QSO's I had with VE2FXL. We used one of the
WSJT JT9 fast-modes designed to decode short-lived meteor scatter
reflections.


So 10 meters may be a good alternative for those who do not have 6 meter
capability and would like to try meteor scatter. It's also a way to make
use of 10 meters during the lull in the sunspot cycle or at night when
the band becomes dormant.

Tony -K2MO






Ev Tupis <w2ev@...>
 

Hi Tony,

The Meteor Scatter based PSK31 successes took place during meteor showers and were corroborated by similar success using AX.25 over the same pathway.  In the early days, our Probes included both modes, making this much easier.

On 10 meters, meteor ionization lasts for a very long time (on the order of 30 seconds to several minutes).  Our system tracked the stream, so doppler wasn't an issue.

I haven't given alot of thought about mining the PropNET database for such occurrences, however doing so should be possible...especially in low sunspot times where Es isn't "noise". Lol.

Of course aircraft scatter would present itself much like MS so one would have to consider how to ID and remove that from the data set.

Cheers,
Ev


On Thursday, January 3, 2019, 4:19:43 PM EST, Tony <DXDX@...> wrote:


Ev:

With PSK31 printing less than 3 characters per second, I would assume the productive periods you're referring to coincide with major showers where meteor trail reflections are long enough in duration to capture call signs?

I take it that there's little data being captured during non-shower periods (daily sporadic activity) where vast majority of the reflections are short-lived?

Is there a way to search the PropNet archives to see the data you're referring to?

Tony -K2MO



On 12/21/2018 3:36 AM, Ev Tupis via Groups.Io wrote:
In the early days of PropNET (http://www.PropNET.org) we used AX.25 on 10 and 6 meters.  We found 10 meters to be very productive for meteor work as a result.  We have since moved to PSK31 where we have documented MS propagation on that mode, too.

Interestingly, the "sweet spot" for commercial meteor scatter operations is in the 40 MHz range right between those two bands.

Ev, W2EV

PS: The PropNET Project will be end on or about December 31 after 20 years of operation.



On Thursday, December 20, 2018, 5:07:04 PM EST, Tony <DXDX@...> wrote:


All:

The idea of using meteor scatter to communicate on a dead 10 meter band
caught my attention many years ago. I've done extensive testing since
then and found that meteor scatter is relatively easy to accomplish on
this band.

I've worked 6 meter meteor scatter for many years and the impression one
gets is that QSO success rates are likely to be higher on 10 compared to
6 meters and especially 2 meters.

That observation coincides with general radio meteor theory that says
longer wavelengths provide longer more intense meteor trail reflections
-- something I've seen repeatedly during testing which is shown in the
attached spectrogram.

To illustrate what a 10 meter meteor scatter QSO is like, I recorded a
short video of one of the QSO's I had with VE2FXL. We used one of the
WSJT JT9 fast-modes designed to decode short-lived meteor scatter
reflections.


So 10 meters may be a good alternative for those who do not have 6 meter
capability and would like to try meteor scatter. It's also a way to make
use of 10 meters during the lull in the sunspot cycle or at night when
the band becomes dormant.

Tony -K2MO






Tony
 

Ev Tupis wrote:

On 10 meters, meteor ionization lasts for a very long time

The occasional long-duration ping would certainly make PSK31 useful Ev. In theory, the duration of the reflection is proportional to the square of the wavelength so the upper HF bands do have an advantage over VHF.   

In the early days, I experimented with Fast Hellschreiber which I thought might have an advantage over high-speed CW. Unfortunately, it lacked sensitivity so it took a fair amount of power to print well. The attached image shows a strong but short-lived reflection taken during a 10 meter test session.

Of course aircraft scatter would present itself much like MS so one would have to consider how to ID and remove that from the data set.

 
Yes it's difficult to distinguish MS from AC scatter without recording the duration of the reflections. You could eliminate all reports within aircraft scatter range (500 miles) and take all others as meteor scatter out to 1300 miles.

I often do this while monitoring my own reports when working meteor scatter on 6 and 2 meters. I've attached a few screen shots that show several reports well beyond aircraft scatter range. 

Tony -K2MO


 

and were corroborated by similar success using AX.25 over the same pathway.  In the early days, our Probes included both modes, making this much easier.

On 10 meters, meteor ionization lasts for a very long time (on the order of 30 seconds to several minutes).  Our system tracked the stream, so doppler wasn't an issue.

I haven't given alot of thought about mining the PropNET database for such occurrences, however doing so should be possible...especially in low sunspot times where Es isn't "noise". Lol.

Of course aircraft scatter would present itself much like MS so one would have to consider how to ID and remove that from the data set.

Cheers,
Ev


On Thursday, January 3, 2019, 4:19:43 PM EST, Tony <DXDX@...> wrote:


Ev:

With PSK31 printing less than 3 characters per second, I would assume the productive periods you're referring to coincide with major showers where meteor trail reflections are long enough in duration to capture call signs?

I take it that there's little data being captured during non-shower periods (daily sporadic activity) where vast majority of the reflections are short-lived?

Is there a way to search the PropNet archives to see the data you're referring to?

Tony -K2MO



On 12/21/2018 3:36 AM, Ev Tupis via Groups.Io wrote:
In the early days of PropNET (http://www.PropNET.org) we used AX.25 on 10 and 6 meters.  We found 10 meters to be very productive for meteor work as a result.  We have since moved to PSK31 where we have documented MS propagation on that mode, too.

Interestingly, the "sweet spot" for commercial meteor scatter operations is in the 40 MHz range right between those two bands.

Ev, W2EV

PS: The PropNET Project will be end on or about December 31 after 20 years of operation.



On Thursday, December 20, 2018, 5:07:04 PM EST, Tony <DXDX@...> wrote:


All:

The idea of using meteor scatter to communicate on a dead 10 meter band
caught my attention many years ago. I've done extensive testing since
then and found that meteor scatter is relatively easy to accomplish on
this band.

I've worked 6 meter meteor scatter for many years and the impression one
gets is that QSO success rates are likely to be higher on 10 compared to
6 meters and especially 2 meters.

That observation coincides with general radio meteor theory that says
longer wavelengths provide longer more intense meteor trail reflections
-- something I've seen repeatedly during testing which is shown in the
attached spectrogram.

To illustrate what a 10 meter meteor scatter QSO is like, I recorded a
short video of one of the QSO's I had with VE2FXL. We used one of the
WSJT JT9 fast-modes designed to decode short-lived meteor scatter
reflections.


So 10 meters may be a good alternative for those who do not have 6 meter
capability and would like to try meteor scatter. It's also a way to make
use of 10 meters during the lull in the sunspot cycle or at night when
the band becomes dormant.

Tony -K2MO